Talk:Sherpa people

(PoV?)

Oops! My article edit was supposed to be "minor". Does the "completely without parallel" sentence strike anyone else as lacking in NPOV? Ventura 15:56, 2004 Jul 29 (UTC)

After the above (and addition of an above-the-discussions template), the accompanying article was moved from Sherpa 15:15, 14 March 2005‎, but this talk page was left behind. Nevertheless, a resourceful editor managed to respond in the proper place, with the following:^{--Jerzy•t 06:14, 25 July 2012 (UTC)}

• It did. I changed it, trying to retain the idea of a great accomplishment without gushing. Kerowyn 07:08, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

This talk page got its corresponding rename on 04:36, 29 June 2005.
On 11 May 2006‎, the next editor (an IP) replaced the entire content with vandalism, and a significant contributor (presumably without consulting the history?) blanked the page the same day.‎ I've restored all the non-vandalistic edits of this section (adding a retrofitted section heading), and also restored the {{todo}} box above it.^{--Jerzy•t 06:14, 25 July 2012 (UTC)}

Two meanings

Is it accurate to say that using the word to describe mountain guides is "incorrect," as the article states? I think it's truer that the term for the guides derived from the ethnic group, and that the word can mean either thing. Merriam-Webster notes both definitions. Any objections to my rewording this? --djrobgordon 19:12, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

I think you are right on -- everyone I talk to that has heard the word knows the "mountain guide" sense of the word, so in common usage it seems that sherpa has developed this meaning even if it originally didn't mean that. Dalijon 09:59, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

I agree with both of you. But that was then. I have many Sherpa acquaintances, and there are times when they get offended by the term guide being synonymous to Sherpa.

While the term "Sherpa" has been misappropriated for a variety of uses in the Western sphere, this is a process that has resulted without consultation or consent from the Sherpa community. Perpetuating the view that 'Sherpa' is synonymous with 'mountain guide' is a misconception, and quite disrespectful. It might be useful to think of it as comparable say, the terms 'Navajo', 'Maori' or 'Innuit' - all names of ethnic groups that have, at various times in Western history been unfairly associated with stereotyped professions or behaviours. In all of these instances, members of these groups have to fight to have their name viewed as connected with a living culture rather than an Anglophile stereotype. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dzemu (talk • contribs) 20:49, 3 March 2012 (UTC)

Can we add language to Sherpa (not "Sherpa People") or even the Wiktionary page that makes this clearer and addresses the potentially inflammatory misappropriation? I'd love to have somewhere to point people as a quick explanation. ~E$ (talk) 11:44, 18 March 2014 (UTC)

Yes, apparently we need to mention sardar (leader, guide, head man) and kulli (porter, cargo carrier), which are loanwords from Persian and Hindi. Himalayan phrasebooks such as https://www.chicagonepal.com/learn-nepali-language/ indicate those are the preferred terms used by native mountaineering teams, but the Nepal mountain guide association might have a more authoritative source. Ahazred8 (talk) 03:00, 22 March 2019 (UTC)

I would be inclined to split this article into two: One for the ethnic Sherpa people, the second for the 'small s' sherpa livelihoods of mountain guiding. There is so much information on both and they are not synonymous. Franceslk (talk) 11:05, 23 April 2019 (UTC)franceslk

A proposal.

Would anyone be interested in starting up a Wikiproject: Sherpa People? I think it's a good idea, I would be fully involved. I really dislike Wikipedia's following the poor Western trait of offering more info on the climbers and not the Sherpas, who if without the Western climbers would never have made it this far in Himalayan mountaineering. Thoughts? I'm very keen and at the moment I'm doing up articles on various Sherpas that must be mentioned on Wikipedia. --Bentonia School 14:53, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

I just read this, and I fully agree. Great names that [IMHO] ought to be added; Pasang Kikuli, Pasang Dawa Lama, Pintsoo, Ang Tharkay, and a great many more. Feel free to suggest other giants. Qwrk (talk) 13:28, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

I am very interested! how does one go about this? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dzemu (talk • contribs) 05:17, 12 November 2012 (UTC)

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Sensitivity? to low oxygen

This article states:

Sherpas' climbing ability is the result of a genetic adaptation to living in high altitudes. Some of these adaptations include...lungs with an increased sensitivity to low oxygen.

If a person's lungs are more efficient in low oxygen conditions than most other people, is it correct to say that person's lungs have increased sensitivity to low oxygen? Someone who is sensitive to cold, for example, would be expected to perform poorly in cold weather conditions. Yet in this context, "sensitivity to low oxygen" implies the opposite. Racerx11 (talk) 22:30, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

Actually I am going to be bold and change the wording to something like "increased efficiency at low oxygen levels" Racerx11 (talk) 22:41, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

   Bold is good, but i'm going to tag if not already done. The respiratory system is full of surprises, like failure to inhale in nitrogen in contrast to frantic gasping in carbon dioxide!
   The analogy suggested actually could support the content that was replaced; you-all's line of reasoning reflects our awareness that sensitivity in passive systems magnifies the effect: water in the cold or milk in the heat are more sensitive to those respective conditions if they are poorly insulated, and will, respectively, freeze or curdle faster. But the respiratory and thermal regulations systems are active, at the least using feedback to regulate their respective activity levels. If you're in the cold and an anesthetic has desensitized you to cold, your metabolism will respond weakly to the threat of hypothermia; if there are low-oxygen-concentration sensory or chemical mechanisms, people with lots of ancestors who survived by physiologically adjusting more forcefully to atmospheric hypoxia should have inherited any greater sensitivity in the those mechanisms. The more i think about it, the more plausible the removed wording becomes for me.
   The colleague mentioning "sensitivity" may have been grasping at verbal straws, but we've no evidence of that.
--Jerzy•t 07:07, 25 July 2012 (UTC)

   Yeah. Our money should have been on the guy who (apparently) provided the reference on the sentence in question, not the one who (apparently) left a reference in place without verifying that the reference supports the new language.

The Andes natives are barrel-chested and have large lungs with extra alveloi and more capillaries. Their hearts are bigger, with well-developed muscles in the right ventricle--the chamber that pumps blood under high pressure through the pumonary artery into the lungs. They have increased numbers of red blood cells to transport oxygen and an increased volume of plasuma in which to float them so the blood doesn't sludge. Their adaptations seem to be acclimatization pushed to the limits--mechanical changes rather than the biochemical ones of the Sherpas. They do, however, show some adaptations at the molecular level. Like the Sherpas, they demonstrate the lactic acid paradox, and their hearts utilize glucolse. Their lungs produce extra nitric oxide, though not as much as the Sherpas do. However, they still do not share the Sherpas' increased lung sensitivity to low oxygen or their special hemoglobin-binding enzymes.

--Jerzy•t 07:40, 25 July 2012 (UTC)

Well hey, I was just trying to help out. 17 months I was green with very little experience. Additionally, I did not put near the thought into the issue as you have. Thanks for your efforts in the matter. --RacerX¹¹ Talk to me^{Stalk me} 21:44, 25 July 2012 (UTC)

Intro

The opening section of this article reads like an argument. It would be good to reconcile the individual paragraphs into one narrative. 86.151.120.166 (talk) 20:56, 4 March 2012 (UTC)

Ok see Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Lead section. Zulu Papa 5 * (talk) 21:07, 4 March 2012 (UTC)

Sherpas: Youngest woman to climb everest

According to the article about Ming Kipa, Ming Kipa is the youngest woman to climb everest, not "16-year-old Nima Chhamzi Sherpa" as claimed in this article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.68.222.124 (talk) 08:40, 29 May 2013 (UTC)

I have to query her being described as a woman? At 16 she is surely a girl? An amazing one, but a girl. She would be the youngest 'female'. PeterM88 (talk) 22:22, 19 October 2013 (UTC)

Full names of people who died on Mount Everest leading others as Sherpa's?

Ankaji Sherpa was one of the 13 Nepalese guides who died in an avalanche in April 2014. Is there a cultural sensitivity related to the names of the dead in the Sherpa tradition? It seems inappropriate and outdated in 2014 to continue to name and celebrate reaching the top of Mount Everest without providing the full names of the porters and guides who made these expeditions possible. This article describes how the work done by these porters and guides is so high risk that the "Nepal's trekking agents are required by law to buy life and rescue insurance" for their porters. The average amount is "$11,000 that needs to go to replace the income a worker would have for 10 or 20 years." They do the heaviest lifting, the most dangerous jobs with the least amount of oxygen and earn $5000 a season compared to $50,000 earned by Western guides. "174 climbing Sherpas died while working in Nepal's mountains since the 1980s.

See also oceanflynn 14:44, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

References

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Rollback

I rolled back the edits because they didn't follow the sources. Zulu Papa 5 * (talk) 12:51, 20 August 2018 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:

• Sherpa girl with her ethnic dress.jpg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 23:03, 9 June 2019 (UTC)

History section starts mid-sentence

First sentence of history section seems to start mid-sentence ("Tibet to Solukhumbu at different times..."), but I feel like more context is needed to know how to fix it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Drewbigs (talk • contribs) 22:07, 9 May 2022 (UTC)

this needs encyclopedic sources for these notable claims

these are inspirational stories and claims, and every one of them has need of a source, correctly cited and attributed.

too large of claims, biography of living persons, to remain.

Saintstephen000 (talk)

Everest brawl

The section on Everest Brawl is written distinctly out of the Wikipedia style. Reads unprofessionally with many grammatical errors. 2603:7000:50F0:83E0:31C7:D37B:BA7B:48BF (talk) 17:21, 21 February 2023 (UTC)

Population of Sherpas

The infobox in the article currently informs the reader that the population of Sherpas is 520 000. The source given is the POPULATION MONOGRAPH OF NEPAL VOLUME II (Social Demography), published by the Governenment of Nepals Central Bureau of Statistics. In several places in that report it is stated that the population of Sherpas were 152 622 in a 2001 census and 112 946 in a 2011 census, for example page 10, page 21, page 27, page 44.

The article footnote refers to the pages 10-156 in the report which makes it difficult to discern where exactly the population figure 520 000 is supposed to be found. As it stands the figure given in the wikipedia article appears to be exaggerated and lacking a proper a source. 155.4.221.64 (talk) 10:47, 1 June 2023 (UTC)

removed/restored paragraph in History section

Hi Szelma W: I'm a bit confused as to why you undid my revision on this article. As I stated in the edit summary, there are multiple problems with the paragraph I removed and the sources cited therein. None of them are fixed by updating the references' links to archived pages.

The first source (tapting.org) cites "Gautam (1994)" and "Ethnographic Museum (2001)", but provides no citations that would help evaluate its conclusions. This is especially problematic since I did manage to track down "Oppitz (1974)" - https://www.repository.cam.ac.uk/items/a563b703-d6c5-4d13-ae13-ac0677eb9274 - which contradicts some of the information on the page. It's also not clear what connection tapting.org has to Tapting, but links to it have repeatedly been removed from the village's Wikipedia page for not being the official website.

The second source (Asia-planet.net) is a travel site's page about the Nepal Ethnographic Museum, but it contains no information about the 2001 study and doesn't support the text it is being used for (which is a confused paraphrasing of text from the tapting.org page).

- Martey (talk) 21:20, 5 December 2023 (UTC)

Hi Martey: Please feel free to remove the paragraph again. Now I understand why you have removed the paragraph. I thought there was a problem with dead url links, so I have retrieved the paragraph and I have replaced the links with archive urls. Regards Szelma W (talk) 21:39, 5 December 2023 (UTC)

Hi Martey: please review the recent changes to this article and decide whether to revert them. Regards

Szelma W (talk) 08:37, 11 December 2023 (UTC)